India’s TCS Defends U.S. Visa Use in Anti-White Worker Bias Case

[TampaChinnodu]

• Lawsuit reaches turning point amid Trump’s protectionist push
• Company says not as many Americans want its U.S. positions

As India’s Tata Consultancy Services Ltd. is squeezed by the Trump administration to reduce the use of overseas workers for U.S. jobs, the information technology outsourcing giant is also fighting claims in court that its hiring practices are anti-American.

 

TCS, Asia’s largest software maker, and Infosys Ltd., a rival Indian outsourcing firm, are both embroiled in civil rights lawsuits accusing them of discriminating against white IT workers that predate Donald Trump’s election last year.

 

Even as the outsourcers are responding to the president’s protectionist agenda by hiring more Americans in the U.S., Mumbai-based TCS cites its reliance on foreign guest-worker visas as a defense against the bias claims.

 

The men suing TCS allege discriminatory hiring practices explain why as much as 79 percent of its U.S. workforce is South Asian when that group makes up only 12.5 percent of the relevant labor market in the U.S.

 

But the company contends it’s misleading to include employees hired in India to work temporarily and “legally” in the U.S., many with H1-B visas for specially skilled employees. It also says more than 40 percent of its job applicants are South Asians and that not everyone is keen on working for an India-based company or willing to relocate to take a job.

Summary Judgment

At a hearing Tuesday in federal court in Oakland, California, on whether to dismiss the case entirely, U.S. District Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers said she would take the issue under submission. She indicated that she would deny the motion for summary judgment, at least as far as it involves white U.S. employees who were fired from Tata. She was less impressed by the evidence that Tata discriminates against white job applicants.

She told Tata’s lawyers that the plaintiffs “have evidence that they can present to a jury. Whether or not it is persuasive, I am not here to decide.”

The judge didn’t rule on whether to certify the suit as a class action, which would expand it to include potentially of thousands of American workers who either weren’t hired or were fired by TCS because of their race over the past six years.

If the case does proceed as a class action, it may encourage white Americans to pursue similar suits against other companies with heavily foreign workforces, said Andra Greene, a lawyer with Irell & Manella LLP in Newport Beach, California, who isn’t involved in the TCS suit.

‘Masters’ at Statistics

Greene also said it’s a “close” call which side’s numerical analysis will prevail in court. "People are masters at using statistics to argue their point,” she said.

After campaigning on a pledge to punish American companies for moving jobs overseas, Trump put pressure on the offshore IT servicing firms in April when he signed an executive order aimed at overhauling the work-visa programs they use to bring workers to the U.S. The next month, Infosys, which employs about 200,000 people around the world, said it planned to hire 10,000 Americans over the next two years.

The lawsuit against TCS was filed in 2015 by a white IT worker who claimed he was subject to “substantial anti-American sentiment” within the company and was ultimately terminated within 20 months despite having almost 20 years of experience in the field. He was later replaced as the lead plaintiff by two other men.

One, Brian Buchanan, said he worked at Southern California Edison for 28 years when the company outsourced the bulk of its IT work to TCS. He was among 400 people terminated, but said he was asked to stay on for a few months to train the Indian TCS employees that were replacing him. Buchanan claims that at a job fair organized for the employees losing their jobs, the South Asian TCS regional manager was dismissive of interest in a position.

TCS says Buchanan’s experience doesn’t prove he was a victim of bias. He has ”no idea” whether the application process was discriminatory because he didn’t attend any of the town hall meetings he was invited to during the Edison transition to learn about open positions with TCS and how to apply for them -- and he didn’t apply for a specific job, the company said in a court filing.

“Buchanan’s mere conjecture that he would have received more attention at the job fair if he were not an ‘old bald white man’ is not supported by any facts in the record," lawyers for TCS wrote.

While the company has a stronger defense if the men suing can’t point to any specific evidence that they were mistreated because they aren’t South Asian, that won’t necessarily carry the day, Greene said.

"Usually they don’t tell you I’m not hiring you because you’re white," she said.

‘Corporate Directive’

As for the broader claim that TCS engages in institutional discrimination against Americans, the plaintiffs claim the “highly skewed” workforce results from “a corporate directive to favor visa-ready South Asian Indian national candidates to fill U.S. positions and the use of third-party recruiters that forward to Tata a substantial percentage of South Asian Indian national candidates.”

The company contends there’s a “non-discriminatory” explanation that includes its use of workers with guest visas.

"These individuals are existing employees, were hired in India, and are thus hired from a completely different labor market," the company said in a filing. "They cannot be used to create a statistical disparity between TCS’ workforce and the United States labor market."

The company is “is confident that its evidence, data, and expert analysis” will persuade the judge not to let the case to advance as a class action and expects the claims will be thrown out, said Benjamin Trounson, a spokesman for TCS in North America.

The plaintiffs’ lawyers declined to comment ahead of Tuesday’s hearing.

The four workers who sued Infosys over similar allegations four years ago in Milwaukee are represented by the same law firm that filed the TCS suit. The Infosys case is also awaiting a judge’s decision on dueling requests for dismissal and class-action status.

The TCS case is Heldt v. Tata Consultancy Services Ltd., 15-cv-01696, U.S. District Court, Northern District of California (Oakland).

[TampaChinnodu]

Quote

The men suing TCS allege discriminatory hiring practices explain why as much as 79 percent of its U.S. workforce is South Asian when that group makes up only 12.5 percent of the relevant labor market in the U.S.

[princeofheaven]

13 minutes ago, TampaChinnodu said:

• Lawsuit reaches turning point amid Trump’s protectionist push
• Company says not as many Americans want its U.S. positions

As India’s Tata Consultancy Services Ltd. is squeezed by the Trump administration to reduce the use of overseas workers for U.S. jobs, the information technology outsourcing giant is also fighting claims in court that its hiring practices are anti-American.

 

TCS, Asia’s largest software maker, and Infosys Ltd., a rival Indian outsourcing firm, are both embroiled in civil rights lawsuits accusing them of discriminating against white IT workers that predate Donald Trump’s election last year.

 

Even as the outsourcers are responding to the president’s protectionist agenda by hiring more Americans in the U.S., Mumbai-based TCS cites its reliance on foreign guest-worker visas as a defense against the bias claims.

 

The men suing TCS allege discriminatory hiring practices explain why as much as 79 percent of its U.S. workforce is South Asian when that group makes up only 12.5 percent of the relevant labor market in the U.S.

 

But the company contends it’s misleading to include employees hired in India to work temporarily and “legally” in the U.S., many with H1-B visas for specially skilled employees. It also says more than 40 percent of its job applicants are South Asians and that not everyone is keen on working for an India-based company or willing to relocate to take a job.

Summary Judgment

At a hearing Tuesday in federal court in Oakland, California, on whether to dismiss the case entirely, U.S. District Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers said she would take the issue under submission. She indicated that she would deny the motion for summary judgment, at least as far as it involves white U.S. employees who were fired from Tata. She was less impressed by the evidence that Tata discriminates against white job applicants.

She told Tata’s lawyers that the plaintiffs “have evidence that they can present to a jury. Whether or not it is persuasive, I am not here to decide.”

The judge didn’t rule on whether to certify the suit as a class action, which would expand it to include potentially of thousands of American workers who either weren’t hired or were fired by TCS because of their race over the past six years.

If the case does proceed as a class action, it may encourage white Americans to pursue similar suits against other companies with heavily foreign workforces, said Andra Greene, a lawyer with Irell & Manella LLP in Newport Beach, California, who isn’t involved in the TCS suit.

‘Masters’ at Statistics

Greene also said it’s a “close” call which side’s numerical analysis will prevail in court. "People are masters at using statistics to argue their point,” she said.

After campaigning on a pledge to punish American companies for moving jobs overseas, Trump put pressure on the offshore IT servicing firms in April when he signed an executive order aimed at overhauling the work-visa programs they use to bring workers to the U.S. The next month, Infosys, which employs about 200,000 people around the world, said it planned to hire 10,000 Americans over the next two years.

The lawsuit against TCS was filed in 2015 by a white IT worker who claimed he was subject to “substantial anti-American sentiment” within the company and was ultimately terminated within 20 months despite having almost 20 years of experience in the field. He was later replaced as the lead plaintiff by two other men.

One, Brian Buchanan, said he worked at Southern California Edison for 28 years when the company outsourced the bulk of its IT work to TCS. He was among 400 people terminated, but said he was asked to stay on for a few months to train the Indian TCS employees that were replacing him. Buchanan claims that at a job fair organized for the employees losing their jobs, the South Asian TCS regional manager was dismissive of interest in a position.

TCS says Buchanan’s experience doesn’t prove he was a victim of bias. He has ”no idea” whether the application process was discriminatory because he didn’t attend any of the town hall meetings he was invited to during the Edison transition to learn about open positions with TCS and how to apply for them -- and he didn’t apply for a specific job, the company said in a court filing.

“Buchanan’s mere conjecture that he would have received more attention at the job fair if he were not an ‘old bald white man’ is not supported by any facts in the record," lawyers for TCS wrote.

While the company has a stronger defense if the men suing can’t point to any specific evidence that they were mistreated because they aren’t South Asian, that won’t necessarily carry the day, Greene said.

"Usually they don’t tell you I’m not hiring you because you’re white," she said.

‘Corporate Directive’

As for the broader claim that TCS engages in institutional discrimination against Americans, the plaintiffs claim the “highly skewed” workforce results from “a corporate directive to favor visa-ready South Asian Indian national candidates to fill U.S. positions and the use of third-party recruiters that forward to Tata a substantial percentage of South Asian Indian national candidates.”

The company contends there’s a “non-discriminatory” explanation that includes its use of workers with guest visas.

"These individuals are existing employees, were hired in India, and are thus hired from a completely different labor market," the company said in a filing. "They cannot be used to create a statistical disparity between TCS’ workforce and the United States labor market."

The company is “is confident that its evidence, data, and expert analysis” will persuade the judge not to let the case to advance as a class action and expects the claims will be thrown out, said Benjamin Trounson, a spokesman for TCS in North America.

The plaintiffs’ lawyers declined to comment ahead of Tuesday’s hearing.

The four workers who sued Infosys over similar allegations four years ago in Milwaukee are represented by the same law firm that filed the TCS suit. The Infosys case is also awaiting a judge’s decision on dueling requests for dismissal and class-action status.

The TCS case is Heldt v. Tata Consultancy Services Ltd., 15-cv-01696, U.S. District Court, Northern District of California (Oakland).

veedu job ichina experience unna tellodu evadu veedu iche pay ki join avvadu

[tennisluvr]

16 minutes ago, princeofheaven said:

veedu job ichina experience unna tellodu evadu veedu iche pay ki join avvadu

Join avutharu, they would rather work than sit at home. But since almost all of these organizations have regional politics at every level, they are treated in a discriminatory way quite openly. 

Simply said, the US work place is open and collaborative without the need for anyone to be subservient towards the manager while the Indian corporations are known to be full of favoritism, regional politics, sucking up to the boss/manager etc. So Indian corporations can never be favorable work places in the Western world. Hope this case would become a class action law suit so that our Indian companies finally evolve and run as per the modern world standards. 

[Android_Halwa]

Thinking from an Indian work culture perspective, I really doubt if Americans will be able to work with Indian Outsourcers. 

American will be literally chicken out in no time and no need to fire, he himself will leave the job and the kind of work culture and pressure prevails in Indian outsourcing companies, internal politics, groupism and regional flocking, I really wonder if an American ever would be able to work for an India based outsourcer.

Adding to the list, offshore calls, late night and early morning calls etc...

Best example is Vishal Sikka. Poor chap, we was probably the one who could change the image of Infosys and prepare for the future but we all know what happened to him.

Another example, Cyrus Mistry, Irish born CEO of Pallonji group and the largest shareholder in the Tata Sons, after being elvated as Chairman, Has been ousted from his position by the same board in which he owns a single largest share at 33%. 

Just an example. When people at higher management and CEO level couldn't survive and succeed Indian work culture and demand, I can imagine how tough it would be for an average american to survive in Indian based companies.

[tennisluvr]

Just now, Android_Halwa said:

Thinking from an Indian work culture perspective, I really doubt if Americans will be able to work with Indian Outsourcers. 

American will be literally chicken out in no time and no need to fire, he himself will leave the job and the kind of work culture and pressure prevails in Indian outsourcing companies, internal politics, groupism and regional flocking, I really wonder if an American ever would be able to work for an India based outsourcer.

Adding to the list, offshore calls, late night and early morning calls etc...

They won't work. Simply said, this outsourcing model itself is going to die a sure death very soon. Offshore calls, late night and early morning calls etc are not going to be appreciated by the people here because they don't consider themselves automatons that are simply alive to serve a corporation. Work/life balane ki importance istharu kabatte they won't put up with that sh**t. However, since the fact that us Indians seem to have no idea of such a concept and would rather slave away our existence working for such corporations, this is being exploited by the mostly White project managers in the US that outsource these jobs to WITCH corporations. 

So the only ones winning here are the WITCH company and the White/Black/(insert any color) client manager who outsources the project to the WITCH company. Both the American worker who's laid off and the Indian automaton WITCH employee who's slaving away his life to such a corporation are winning nothing here essentially. 

Really hope this becomes a class action lawsuit, that's the only hope. Else kiss goodbye to IT, WITCHes will take over entire IT field in this nation. 

[Android_Halwa]

I don't believe that outsourcing will die but its going to evolve.

Americans taught Indians the art of IT business. Unknowingly Indians mastered this art so well that we are none to second. Its just that Indian IT soft power prowess is hidden behind the desperate dreams of getting  green card or the hope of still making it big in the service sector in the offshore. As long as the billing rates are assured, These companies will go to any extent to get things done.

But, if they feel that their business itself is under threat or the model is dying, These guys will make sure they evolve certain model where they will make double the profits than what they are doing now. Indians already reached senior management and American companies don;t want to involve in this deep sheet anymore. I will pay you and get the job done is the new mantra no matter who and where the job is getting done. 

WITCH companies will go to any extent to save their business model.

Infosys said it will hire 20,000 people over the next five years and will start 4 centers in US. Reality is that these 4 centers will be filled by H1B's and OPT's, They will stop import and convert OPT's to H1b...

This ugly business won;t stop...

[Android_Halwa]

Look at how Vishal Sikka and Cyrus Mistry kicked out of their roles...perfect example to say only an Indian can survive in Indian based MNC's..

on the contrary, there are Indian Americans heading top notch companies but when the same Indian Americans are miserable failure running India based service companies.

[tennisluvr]

1 minute ago, Android_Halwa said:

I don't believe that outsourcing will die but its going to evolve.

Americans taught Indians the art of IT business. Unknowingly Indians mastered this art so well that we are none to second. Its just that Indian IT soft power prowess is hidden behind the desperate dreams of getting  green card or the hope of still making it big in the service sector in the offshore. As long as the billing rates are assured, These companies will go to any extent to get things done.

But, if they feel that their business itself is under threat or the model is dying, These guys will make sure they evolve certain model where they will make double the profits than what they are doing now. Indians already reached senior management and American companies don;t want to involve in this deep sheet anymore. I will pay you and get the job done is the new mantra no matter who and where the job is getting done. 

WITCH companies will go to any extent to save their business model.

Infosys said it will hire 20,000 people over the next five years and will start 4 centers in US. Reality is that these 4 centers will be filled by H1B's and OPT's, They will stop import and convert OPT's to H1b...

This ugly business won;t stop...

No way they won't be eligible to hire H1Bs for these positions, same with OPTs. Most probably the OPT period will be reduced to 12 months only without the 17 month extension within the next year, once that happens they won't be hired. Because the clause usually would be that there needs to be a certain minimum duration upto which they have to keep these 20,000 people employed. You can't just hire them enmasse one day and fire them after a month and say you have hired 20,000 people locally. It doesn't work that way. 

Once things get even further automated, Indian IT corps can kiss their service delivery model a goodbye. 

[tennisluvr]

2 minutes ago, Android_Halwa said:

Look at how Vishal Sikka and Cyrus Mistry kicked out of their roles...perfect example to say only an Indian can survive in Indian based MNC's..

on the contrary, there are Indian Americans heading top notch companies but when the same Indian Americans are miserable failure running India based service companies.

End of the day these are much family run entities as any other smaller non IT Indian company is, and that's one of the reasons the above people were let go since they didn't suit their agenda. 

The Indian Americans that head top notch companies are usually those that have worked in such corporations, not those that have become masters of slave trade working at some Indian IT service company trying to bid cheaper while getting ready to kill their workers by setting them  impossible targets to achieve. 

[Pipucbn]

TCS egastralu pothe Thatha occhi G meedha 10thadu

[tennisluvr]

1 minute ago, Pipucbn said:

TCS egastralu pothe Thatha occhi G meedha 10thadu

Vadiki antha ledu le, baaton ka sher plus he's pro wealthy guys. Those wealthy guys are the ones that are happy to ensure this slave system keeps working this way. 

[Pipucbn]

2 minutes ago, tennisluvr said:

Vadiki antha ledu le, baaton ka sher plus he's pro wealthy guys. Those wealthy guys are the ones that are happy to ensure this slave system keeps working this way. 

Repubs are known for that... Bush Thatha same chesadu oil companies tho... 1.5/gallon unde has ni 3.8 chesi poyadu.... pothu pothu recession kuda thecchadu

[tennisluvr]

2 minutes ago, Pipucbn said:

Repubs are known for that... Bush Thatha same chesadu oil companies tho... 1.5/gallon unde has ni 3.8 chesi poyadu.... pothu pothu recession kuda thecchadu

Bush family owned oil companies so vaadiki swalabham undi le andulo baane. 

[JollyBoy]

45 minutes ago, tennisluvr said:

Join avutharu, they would rather work than sit at home. But since almost all of these organizations have regional politics at every level, they are treated in a discriminatory way quite openly. 

Simply said, the US work place is open and collaborative without the need for anyone to be subservient towards the manager while the Indian corporations are known to be full of favoritism, regional politics, sucking up to the boss/manager etc. So Indian corporations can never be favorable work places in the Western world. Hope this case would become a class action law suit so that our Indian companies finally evolve and run as per the modern world standards. 

tats not always true